Bivalent Shot WaPo Comments: Trends, Anecdotes
Schadenfreude on a Friday. And, anecdotes support predicting that US bivalent uptake will surge in coming weeks (at least compared to current level).
Housekeeping:
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I have turned on the substack paid subscription thing. This is for a few different reasons which I won’t bore the reader listing, essentially centered on what the best relationship is with this journal and Substack, the company — not the best relationship with the reader.
The latter relationship I hope to keep going as before — Unglossed is open to all to read and comment, but is written for my at-will, donation supporters. (Sadly, I can’t do anything about the grueling “click here gauntlet” future subscribers will now encounter when they join; I can only hope Substack one day elects to improve that experience on their own.)
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I do still hope to post “Prions, pt 2” today.
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Comments found on Diamond, Dan. Gahan, Mary Beth. Johnson, Mark. “Few Americans get new covid booster shot ahead of projected winter surge.”
Take-aways:
If buyer’s remorse for post-vaccine (“breakthrough”) infections or adverse events is driving Americans away from further shots, it is also driving them away from the WaPo comments page:
Commenters with anecdotes of vaccine failure still praise the vaccine.
Commenters usually boast of just a “sore arm.” (The two anecdotes here of worse adverse events are outliers.)
Both these trends are probably just comment thread self-selection bias. There are exceptions, like Fake News Bot: “I’ll never get another booster. Eat my butt.”
Demand for bivalent shots may be much higher than appears now, especially in coming weeks:
Numerous reports of difficulty locating shots
Many are just waiting because of recent (vaccine failure) summer infections
And so the next few weeks may wind up resembling the late summer, 2021. In the latter case, widespread uptake of the 3rd dose followed the overnight panic over the Delta wave. We’ll see. I predict that official figures for adult bivalent uptake (currently at 4% of “eligible”) eventually land in the 30s.
No support, only vitriol for the story’s only-double-injected subject, Joe Gonzales. “Hopefully his employer learns about what he has said in this article,” writes LightningMcGeek.
Religious certainty that the vaccines stop transmission is never going to die.1 As a correlate, all vaccine failure is a consequence of the unvaccinated (since only they can transmit). This is the reality a substantial segment of humanity will always live in.
In the other camp, religious certainty that “vaccines” were never historically expected to prevent infection, and any such impression with the Covid vaccines was due to lay stupidity, is never going to die.2
Emphasis added in all cases.
Anecdotes
Glutton for Punishment 1: “But I never lost sense of smell”!
By keeping up with the vaccine and boosters, I have thus far avoided an actual COVID infection, and by masking and distancing I have avoided most allergies and viruses since the beginning of the pandemic. But I am waiting to get the new booster until I have at least 2 free weeks to recover from it.
Every COVID shot thus far has made me sick with flu-like symptoms, including 3-4 days of agonizing body aches and chills, 1-2 days of deep nausea with one episode of violent dry heaves, plus profound exhaustion that took 2-3 weeks to fully fade away. But I never lost sense of smell or taste and never had respiratory issues or a dry cough.3
I assume my reactions were less nasty than an actual infection would be, so I am willing to get every shot I'm offered.
But every time, I need to block out 2 weeks for the worst of the side effects, and I suspect I am not alone.
(You know what they say about assuming.)
Glutton for Punishment 2: “I don’t even care if I live” (I got boosted for your sins)
I had a horrible reaction from Moderna and the first booster. The second booster was Pfizer and I only experienced slight aches. The updated booster was also Pfizer and a day and a half after I never felt worse. I wouldn't have had to go through that if more people had gotten vaccinated, worn masks and practiced other pandemic precautionary measures. At this point, I got vaccinated to avoid infecting others. I don't even care if I live much longer due to Republicans and fascists being adored around the world.
2 weeks to bivalent failure
No surprise, the 5th shot does not appear to prevent symptomatic infection (it would be nice to know what the actual antibody kinetics are, but at this point it seems like the injected must be trying to turn over a car whose battery is dead; nothing but IgG4 and tolerance left to jack up). Anecdotes of bivalent failure aren’t rampant, but background case rates are low so there’s really no excuse for any infections right now.
We got the latest booster in early September. Returned last week from a trip overseas, my wife has “mild” Covid, I don’t. About half our tour group experienced the same thing boosters in all. Glad we had the shots, but doesn’t necessarily keep you from getting Covid. Good news is that no one in our group got seriously ill.
Like GoodGriefcb below, I too am on my third day of COVID, having started Paxlovid 18 hours after my first symptoms - sore throat progressing to croupy cough, headache, low grade temp, and feeling just awful.
Eight hours of my first dose of Paxlovid, I woke up in the night, and noticed I was feeling better. (I am a physician, and wondered if this was the Placebo effect, but no, this improvement has been seen by a number of my colleagues.) I suspect i will be back to "normal" in 2 days. [That’ll last…]
I have been "Pfizered", "Moderna-ed", boosted x1 Moderna, and Moderna Bivalent boosted 2½ weeks ago after driving 90 miles from Maine to Massachusetts to get a dose at Costco after virtually Maine sites around me were booked a week out. It probably would have been more protective in another month [ha!].
The lessons here [!] are:
1. Don't wait to get boosted even if you are "careful" (my spouse picked this up a restaurant that didn't take reservations and was crowded with mostly "unmasked") [Really? Did the restaurant give out a receipt for the virus? Flagrant, superstitious moron-doctor].
(Naturally the remaining “lessons” do not mention the futility of stupid so-called boosters.)
I left to accompany my elderly mother on a two week bus tour booked before covid. I received the new booster, my 5th, one week before I left, just as they announced it was ready. By the end of the trip, I'd estimate 25-35% of the bus was coughing, and not one wore a mask. "It's my allergies" the excuse. I received glares when I wore a mask, but those group dinners were a real issue. I moved our flight earlier to get home. No surprise, the first morning at home, I test positive. My Mom had Covid six weeks before the trip, and is doing fine. I'm grateful for the antivirals. I will never get on a tour bus again.
As I comment here, I am on day two after testing positive for Covid. Yes, I am fully vaccinated and yes, I got the latest second booster just two weeks ago. I was not prepared for the rapid decline from sore throat to headache and extreme chest pain and deep, dry cough. Fortunately my physician prescribed an anti-viral (not the one that causes a rebound or a metallic taste).
This virus is still here and based on my symptoms, can kick even vaccinated butt. Pay attention out there!
Double-dosed are the new unvaxxed
People are home testing, positives. No data from home testing. Over the past two months several of my colleagues (remote) and others in their families have gotten covid, badly. For weeks very ill. A couple may have long term now with the brain fog. Most of them were in good shape too. But they all had something in common, after the initial two vaccines they never got the boosters or the newest vaccine. Right now, one of my friends from work is very ill. She was told by her doctor because she is in good health, she couldn't get the anti-viral. So there is that too.
(A gruesome tale of apparent universal negative efficacy and long covid — and against an Omicron strain! The injected seemed damned if they do, damned if they don’t. One wonders if allaprima believes herself to be just as likely to suffer “for weeks very ill” when her bill finally comes due — all that her extra injections have done is to delay the inevitable. Another anecdote mentions a currently-ongoing rough course in a four-time-injected.4)
"Federal officials recommend that people wait three months since their most recent covid infection or at least two months from their last booster."
This is A LOT OF US at this point, thanks to the doofusses that didn't get boosted last year, allowing omicron to evolve and become more infectious this summer.
Mr. Gonzales is probably not at risk, at least let's hope, but he [double-injected!] is clearly going to be a part of the population that prevents the necessary herd immunity that will prevent the ongoing spread of this disease that continues to kill Americans at an alarming rate.
Add in the risks of "long covid", in particular in children.
I have pretty much forced everyone in my family to focus on and get these boosters, as my view is they cannot hurt [how not?] and will likely help [how?].
I suspect the irresponsible politicization of Covid has had some impact on this as well.
(Duck is trapped in 2021. Don’t send help.)
Joe Gonzalez says he doesn't understand why he needs another booster. Exactly. When you're stupid, you don't understand stuff. When you're stupid, you don't care about other people. Joe Gonzalez doesn't understand because he's stupid, selfish and un-American.
The whole well written and researched article could have been replaced with the statement "Americans like Joe Gonzales are willfully ignorant and self-destructive".
Gonzales is startlingly lazy. He doesn't want to know why he should get the extra shots.
Hopefully his employer learns about what he has said in this article.
Themes
Common Theme 1: Bivalent boosters are difficult to acquire (so demand may be higher than it appears)
Latest booster still isn't available where I am. It has been promised any day now for quite a while.
Are you effing kidding me?!? The earliest I could get an appointment is the end of October, and I tried five different locations (including my insurance medical facilities). These statistics are ridiculous.
A little early for the "build it and they will not come" story, is it not? My husband and I just got the latest booster this week. We had trouble getting it. It took a week to schedule at the local Walgreens, which ran out. It took another week to reschedule with Kaiser.
It's a bit more complicated than it's portrayed in this article. My wife and I got the latest booster 6 days ago, but it was hard finding a pharmacy that had shots available. Our regular pharmacy, in a well known large grocery store near us had no shots, and the nearest location of that same store brand that had shots was 40 miles away, but they only had 5 that were already spoken for.
All of the other locations that were listed on line as pharmacies where COVID boosters could be given were out of stock.
We were finally able to find a CVS pharmacy that had a few shots available if we scheduled a couple of weeks out, so we scheduled the vaccinations and got them done. That pharmacy wasn't listed as having shots available on the state website.
We personally know a lot more people who want the booster but can't get it, then the ones who are complacent about getting it, or refuse to get one.
My wife is driving an hour away to get a booster today. Soonest she could get it in our area was Nov 10.
We are not in a rural area. There just seems to be no one giving the shots.
Did not have this trouble with any of the first 3.
Common theme 2: Delaying a few months because of summer infections, or anticipated winter wave timing
That said, I personally know about a dozen people who have appointments booked for the next couple of weeks. Most of us, myself included, had symptomatic covid in July and are just now hitting our 90 day mark
It may not be that people don't want to get the booster, but that they are waiting. I had another breakthrough infection in mid-August, and I have been told to wait 3 months until after my last infection, just in time for our probable next wave here in NYC.
I've been good about getting the initial vaccination and boosters as soon as possible, but I came down with covid on Labor Day so per the CDC guidance I'll be waiting until December to get my booster. I really don't mind since I should have a degree of natural immunity from my recent infection and I'd rather get my booster as we go into the depths of winter with its indoor activities in poorly-ventilated buildings.
i got my 4th booster at the end of June; getting the new one in early Nov. Immunity begins to wane at about 4 months, and I want to have robust protection for the holidays and winter months.
The covid boosters are short lived. I'm waiting a bit longer (and still masking) in hopes of it being active when cases increase. I do watch case numbers for my state and county weekly.
Off-topic bonus: Seven decades of trauma
(Just jotting this one down for potential future use in polio writing.)
I’m 71. Anyone as old or older than I am should not be afraid of vaccines.
We survived childhood because of vaccines and antibiotics in spite of DDT hand held home fly sprayers, leaded gas, atomic bomb testing, killer smog, polluted water, etc.
Just get your shots to protect others if you are too pig headed to do it for your own health and stop complaining.
(Childhood: More lethal than atomic bombs. Get your shots!)
If you derived value from this post, please drop a few coins in your fact-barista’s tip jar.
A commenter does acknowledge the actual reality (though with a bit of mask fantasy tacked on):
The WAPO should not have quoted a woman who “want(s) to be able to travel and not catch it and not inadvertently infect anyone else,” since the boosters, while reducing death/hospitalization, do not prevent infection/transmission. Spreading this mistaken belief drives mistrust of vaccine campaigns, since many of us know people who were boosted and got infected. It also discourages well-meaning people from wearing masks in situations where masking could actually protect others and themselves from infection.
Jean’s comment received a decent 5 likes.
KarenLS is a common example:
I've been tracking COVID since day one when it hit the news in Jan 2020. I've thought the doctors and scientists have done a pretty good job of explaining it all. I do realize that initially there was confusion about the vaccines preventing the disease altogether which is what they all wanted to have happen, and which happens with a lot of the diseases we get vaccines for as children. Sadly, it is more or less like the Flu and we're going to have to live with boosters every year or more frequently.
People should not have a hard time understanding that.
…
Four days since testing positive and three days into antiviral med. I'm told that the fourth booster has helped me from getting a more severe case. Lordy, less severe? Don't become complacent with masking like I did. You can still get covid and if what I am experiencing is less severe, I can't imagine it being worse. People, get vaccinated. It could save your life.
One of the WaPo comments highlighted this gem, which I am only just now reading:
Strokes, heart attacks, sudden deaths: Does America understand the long-term risks of catching COVID?
https://fortune.com/2022/10/06/strokes-heart-attacks-sudden-death-america-long-term-risks-catching-covid-carolyn-barber/
"A 35-year-old acquaintance drops dead from a hemorrhagic stroke. A friend in her 40s, and another in his 70s, experience recurrent spells of extreme dizziness, their hearts pounding in their chests when they stand. A 21-year-old student with no prior medical history is admitted to the ICU with heart failure, while a 48-year-old avid tennis player, previously healthy, suddenly suffers a heart attack. A relative is diagnosed with pericarditis, an inflammation of the protective sac surrounding the heart.
I can’t confirm the exact etiology of all these cases. But every one of the people I mentioned had a history of COVID either days or months beforehand–and all of them experienced only mild cases of infection at the time."
wow...
Thank you for arranging this virtual zoo visit.
I do not have a Washington Post subscription, so thanks a lot for going through hundreds of potentially inane messages and bringing us a sample of Washington Post commenters, whose comments SURVIVED MODERATION.
The state of personal decision making, and mass media, is appalling, and we, the antivaxxers, cannot fix everyone. Thank you for demonstrating that so clearly with your selection of comments.
So if THOSE people really want quarterly boosters, let them have them, at the cost of prolonging the pandemic and creating MORE variants.